Oh I know, protties will ass-u-me that this is just yet another rant against their facile and absurd version of Christianity. But no, it is actually something quite subtle yet very important.
It has taken me about the last two years to really begin to observe the clarity with which the protestantism zeitgeist affects really not just protestants specifically, but in fact, pretty much all of the English-speaking world. Regardless of your religious beliefs, I think if you take the time to read this, and then make some observations, there is a real benefit you might gain from it. Even if you remain a protestant (tragically misguided as that position would be).
In a succinct three sentences, the problem is this:
Protestantism mechanises human beings, and is designed to do so by its ultimate “creator”, reducing the humanity between people and subjugating the individual to ever growing rules, as if he were simply a cog in a machine.
Catholicism (the real one, not the Novus Ordo version, which is just a Satanic perversion of Christianity) on the other hand is religion best suited for human beings, it ennobles, elevates, and improves the condition of the individual at the individual level, and thus of the family, and thus of society at large. Never losing sight that the individual is the key and his or her individuality is a gift and joy when expressed within the protective confines of Catholic dogma.
This assertion, which might at first seem mere opinion, can be verified by you in a number of ways. Most of these are what I would call large scale statistical studies/observations and as such, while individual counter-examples can be found aplenty, they do not in any way invalidate the overall thesis. Here are some of the easiest and most profitable areas you may wish to investigate for yourself:
Marriage – Divorce and Abortion – Family unit Cohesion – Children
While the Novus Ordo Satanic cult has damaged this institution a lot in the intervening nearly 70 years, even today, divorce, even in nominally “Catholic” families is viewed as a great failure and although the stain of scandal is much reduced, there is still a hint of it. This, of course, stems from the concept that marriage should be for life. A stance that the Catholic Church always had, and even the present day Satanic impersonators find difficult to reverse, though they give out annulments like confetti as of late. In fact, until the early 1900s, even amongst protestants, divorce was still quite the stain. It all changed with the introduction of contraception in pill format, invented by a Jew, and readily taken up by Protestantism. Although condoms had existed for a long time, their use was banned by Catholicism, since, as per Catholic dogma, the PRIMARY purpose of marriage, is to raise a family, which means children, which means divorce is out because you should be adult and possessed of reason enough to know this BEFORE you even enter into any kind of sexual liaison with the proposed wife/husband. Meaning you will make your choice based on their suitability for that as your PRIMARY point, and your compatibility in terms of sex, lustful attraction, and so on, only as a distant second, if not third or fourth. The reason being obvious, in that two people actively working towards creating a harmonious environment for their children will both work towards finding a harmonious compatibility of a sexual nature, and, as my pre-Catholic experience tells me, almost any man and any woman can become sexually really quite compatible, when they both aim to do so, even if at first this might not seem the case. The honest wish to have children and raise them together makes it an easy thing to ensure both parties work hard at any apparent incompatibility or lack of symphony in their individual ways. So it all stems from the lack of contraception amongst Catholics, which is a far deeper and fundamental aspect of marriage than most people today, imbibed in the Protestant mindset, even begin to realise. Divorce is the result of placing the lust/attraction/ephemeral traits of the potential partner ahead of the fundamental/primary/lifelong attributes. If your focus is on the ephemerals, these will inevitably change and degrade over time. The fundamental aspects, are far more resilient and knowing this consciously helps you make better choices from the very start. The extreme of this attitude of focusing on the ephemeral instead of the fundamental is, of course, the total inversion of the very essence of marriage, where children are seen as an inconvenience to the extent that we then murder them in the womb. Tearing them literally apart, limb from limb so as to not get in the way of our buying a new iPhone and having sex with whoever we fancy, without any wish to even have a long conversation with them, much less spend a lifetime together. Catholicism has this aspect correct, and protestantism has it completely wrong and inverted. As a result protestant society is no longer family oriented and what children result from the bonobo-like couplings of humans are often urban-feral examples of disrespect, savagery, complete lack of moral character or discipline, and the denizens of broken homes. You can see this in broad terms by simply observing the generic or “average” behaviour of teens in Anglo-Saxon/teutonic countries (which are overwhelmingly protestant) and comparing them to nominally and presently really ex-Catholic countries, like Spain, Portugal, Italy and to a lesser and modified, but still valid extent, South American also ex-Catholic countries. The family unit in such cultures still matters, and children will tend to get corrected sharply and quickly if they behave in unacceptable fashions (much less so now than say 50 years ago, but it still is a much improved situation when compared to the protestant countries).
Anglo-Saxon or (God forbid, American “law”) Vs. Roman law
The British legal system is fundamentally flawed in that it tries to mechanise and compartmentalise human behaviour in a number of pigeon-holes. You kill a person you get punishment X to Z depending on prior case law (that is, whatever happened in the past to some other guy in supposedly similar circumstances will fit here too, regardless of square pegs and round holes). And quite often, even just punishment X regardless, and not even the option of Y or Z.
The American legal system is actually a complete perversion of any hint of justice and merely a façade to keep the average plebeian and brainwashed American mostly quiet, into thinking they have an actual functioning system of law and order, when in truth, all they have is a system designed to keep the oligarchy well and truly above the rest of their society, while they do whatever they please at the expense of the little people.
Roman law, instead is a perfectly humane and human-based legal system, where a general principle applies, but the details to each case are looked at in the specific. So, yes, murder is generally always wrong, but the pre-meditated murder of a little old lady to steal her pension, is quite different from the premeditated murder of a child rapist. And while the Anglo-Saxon system pretends to adhere to this with various degrees of penalties for various degrees of murder, in reality, the practical aspects are that very often people are forced to make a guilty plea in order to avoid prescribed sentences. The Roman system of law, which is rapidly being ousted by the ever-encroaching Americanism spreading like a plague over the planet, is fundamentally different in that it is dependent on human aspects of life that we are all both familiar and subject too. In Italy, still today, construction contracts are only a few pages long, because the so-called spirit of the law, applies and is self-evident to any honest person. By contrast, in UK law, —which remember has a principle of “the reasonable man”— a similar contract, for a similar job, would be at least a couple hundred pages. In America, it is usually a few hundred pages and also references a bunch of other documents which can run to several thousand pages. As in for example, the Federal rules for Acquisition Regulations. Which is a stack of Satanic nonsense compiled into several volumes that sits well above a metre high if you pile them on top of each other.
Work Ethic and Social Dynamics
The protestant work ethic is often touted as a superior thing above those shiftless Catholics. And I myself, having lived mostly in protestant countries and working as a freelancer all of my life, have also, always appreciated the aspect of the “mechanisation” of work-related routines. The interchangeability of personnel, also meant that as long as I outperformed my colleagues, I would always have a job, since I had an almost endless supply of firms that would be only too eager to slot me in, cog-like, in their machinery. And outperforming my colleagues was not hard to do if your slight autism lets you play “by the book” while your Venetian genetics uses all the instinctual genetic humanity involved to produce results the poor binary thinking protestants can’t even imagine, never mind implement. By contrast, working with my countrymen was exasperating, they would almost never respect deadlines and at times even used strong-arm and duplicitous tactics to stay in the game. As in “Eh… you are already neck deep with us, if you try to get rid of us and change supplier you will lose out even more, so… suck it up and wait/pay.” To which my general response was to play along while I set up an alternative, then I would dump the offenders with a claim on them to boot. I had zero interest in wasting my time talking with them about their (or my) dog, children, whatever, that had zero impact on the job. I never particularly enjoyed my job or work, and I tried to avoid the rat race as much as I could, but when I do enter it, I give it my best to perform my job well. My attitude is pretty much samurai/soldier when it comes to work. It may be a necessary evil, but that doesn’t mean I should be half-assed about it. I perform well for whoever hires me, and have always done so, even when the specific people that hired me, or even the company as a whole may have been populated by complete assholes. When/if their evil/retardation/dishonesty/harm-causing behaviour crossed a certain point I simply left. And in a few cases, took corrective action to the point they would fire me. I have never been fired by “surprise”, I always knew it was coming and why, and it was usually because I put them in a position where they either corrected their ways (which, paradoxically would also improve their profit margins) or got rid of me for being a “meddlesome interloper” as they would see it in their corrupt view, instead of an honesty and profit increasing asset, as I would see it, looking merely at the bottom line and not the egos of the people involved.
All of that preamble to say that I too was under the mistaken idea that a Protestant work-ethic was superior. Well… after a couple of years in a decidedly non-protestant operating country, I have to re-evaluate that idea massively. So, here in note form, are the “positives” of the protestant work ethic:
- Increase efficiency in the final result overall
- Increased efficiency in production/delivery/timeline
- Increased efficiency if there is illness/absenteeism
- Reduced down time when critical people die/leave
- Standardisation of systems and methods across the board
- Standardisation even across industries
- A supposed “positive” is work-life being very distinct from home-life
- Due to the standardisation even average or sub-average people can “perform” “adequately”.
Now, pretty much every one of those points turns into a negative for the Catholic work ethic. Less efficient, and so on. However, two of those points above are a “positive” in the Protestant world, but actually a negative in the Catholic world. So let’s consider what the positives of a Catholic work ethic are:
- Personal relationship based results. Loyal customers and well-performing companies are generally given automatic preferential treatment.
- Meritocracy based results. Those that perform well can rise to the top because the average is so generally poor on things like delivery timelines.
- In general, attention to quality in bespoke items is second to none. Timelines are non-existent, but often quality is unmatched by Protestant systems until those systems are mechanised by sufficiently advanced technology; in some industries this wipes out the Catholic competition, but in others the Catholic version is unlikely to ever be replaced by mere AI and higher technology.
- The absence of a neat separation between work and home life seems impractical and intrusive to Protestants, but, if your society is composed of Catholic-observant human beings, then there should be no huge separation. Which is why they take a siesta in the middle of the day and see their families for lunch. The human connection aspect is more important than the chase for profit margins. Seeing your children at lunch-time and taking a break is good for the family and the mental health of all involved. The customer is of course important, but always second-fiddle to my family and my good friends. As it should be. And of course, those good customers that become also friends, eh… you might work through the weekend or at 3 am to help them out. Because they are friends, not because of profit.
- The relationships are generally more human-based. In general, if I do work with an Italian firm (after careful selection and experience with them) I am also happy having those guys over for lunch at my house or vice-versa. This has hardly ever been the case with the semi-automatons I worked with (even quite pleasantly) in the Anglo-Saxon world. While I am happy enough having Giovanni the client or sub-contractor over for lunch, the last fucking thing either me or John from the UK want, is to spend any more time in each other’s company after work. And that’s even if I like John and he likes me. John may be a great guy, and he may think the same of me, but John knows, that he will see me at the office, and he will keep well away from my front door. And I will extend the same basic courtesy to him. This is why Anglos will have “team-building” days. The Latins look at that and go, “What is this shit? Are you trying to force us to like each other? That’s not gonna work!” And it doesn’t. I never heard of a Latin firm doing “team-building” days. They do invite and spoil clients to lavish dinners or things like that, but even then, it is only in the last decade or so that this has become more common-place. And generally used to be more of a way to introduce themselves to a client. Hey we build blue widgets and you seem to like blue widgets, can we take you for a nice dinner and chill so you will later come visit our factory and see what you think?
In short then, the protestant work ethic is a better machine. But do you want to spend half your life inside a machine? Or would you rather spend your life surrounded by all the messy inefficiency of humans, but also their beautiful and redeeming human aspects too? I for one was convinced the Protestant way was better. I am misanthropic by nature (and by virtue of my IQ I learned later in life, which makes me feel generally bored or exasperated by average humans for the most part) and have learnt since a young age that I can be fine in quite extended solitude. However, if you develop your charity, humanity, and grace, broadening your perspective of the average human (yes, ok, he may not grasp physics, or astronomy, or respect deadlines, or keep proper accounts, or, or, or… but… he is a great dad, a loyal husband, and will come help you with totally unrelated stuff at 2 am because he’s a good guy) then the Catholic perspective is INFINITELY better, because it allows you to interact with your fellow humans in a much more pleasant way even if you have very little in common with them, and that interaction is not the same as the plastic-world “Have a nice day!” of the USA. It may be a grumpy “Ah, what a shit day, fighting with the wife, screw it!” or it may be “Have a nice day!” but it is intrinsically more human and connected. So yeah, you may not get your work done in the timelines you wanted and if that is all you see, you will eventually move to a 15 minute city merely for the organised functions. Or you know, a prison. Things run on time there too. But if you are interested in the humanity of life, then, you will begin to enjoy the messy side of life, out here in the Catholic “jungle”.
The Subtle Implications of Boxed-in/Binary Thinking
This is the most subtle aspect, but —in my opinion— also the most important. Because Catholicism is true, and founded on God’s Will, it generates a certain “built-in” charity and grace when dealing with the rest of humanity, tempered by a steely resolve to do whatever is necessary to preserve our way of life, our loved ones, and innocents in general. There is a very wide and fluid range of human interactions, which have as wide a capacity for harmony even between very different personalities as possible. Which is not to say that there are not hard lines. There are. But, just as God finds extremely improbable, even miraculous ways to turn even evil to an ultimate good, so too, the average Catholic has a much wider supply of responses to life and other people, all while inhabiting the very clear lines of Catholic dogma. The protestant, not having a culture or tradition, or habit of being imbibed in humanity and its myriad idiosyncrasies, nor viewing them through a theological lens that is also in keeping with both God’s mercy and charity as well as God’s Justice, is far more limited in his response to both situations and people. Things tend to fall into a good or bad category. Permissible or forbidden. Much like the Anglo legal systems, these approaches to life, events, and especially other people, including your children, is very sub-optimal, and over time leads to quite serious perversions of reality and life. Particularly for the raising of children.
My wife at times got upset with me for treating each of our children differently when faced with situations that are apparently, superficially, the same. It took some time for her to begin to appreciate what I explained, that each child is unique, and their internal motivations, drives, and responses are unique and different from each other. It has absolutely nothing to do with any child being more or less like me, or me caring more or less about any one of them over another. I would take a bullet for any of them without hesitation in exactly the same fashion. The point is that you need to adjust the lesson to the individual (again, Roman Law over Anglo “law”).
Having had the benefit of doing and teaching martial arts for some decades, it became very clear that everyone improved faster when the lesson was general for everyone, but the corrections or suggestions were unique to every person in the class. how much more important this is with your own children!
But to a Protestant, this can seem unfair, unbalanced, or being biased or preferential of one person, or group of people, over another. It certainly can appear that way, and be experienced that way by the subject of the treatment, but it is in fact, nothing of the sort. It is the best approximation of actual Justice, since one tries to adapt the situation to the details of the individual or group involved. Anyone that has ever been in serious martial arts, or life and death situations on a regular basis as a pert of their routine, will understand this. Farmers will understand this too. Basically anyone that has to deal with reality in ways that give a serious consequence if you don’t deal with reality but rather your own erroneous perception or idea of it.
This “simplification” of perception, is a real issue and a real problem in the Protestant dominated Zeitgeist (which is pretty much almost completely global by now). And it applies at every level of life, be it the interpretation of natural phenomena (see Rupert Sheldrake’s excellent ideas on even things such as the speed of light on this and other topics), reality in general, theological concepts simplified to the absurd (sola scriptura, sola fides, once saved always saved, all completely unmitigated nonsense any normal child of ten sees for the completely illogical rubbish it is), and really, pretty much all human interactions. Everything from sex (instead of lovemaking) to friendship, becomes transactional and calculated, even if unconsciously, to an extent that damages and degrades the actual humanity between humans. And in fact has steadily done so for five centuries, and taken some nitrous oxide in the last fifty or so.
Conclusions
The afternoon siesta, the inability to use watches or stick to well-balanced “just-in time” delivery schedules, all pale in comparison to the benefits gained by stopping in the middle of your work-day because you saw Paolo and you grab a coffee together, as is, your ability to forgive Giorgio for having done the same thing and coming to pick up your car a day late.
Just as I would rather die fighting to be left OUT of a 15 minute city, in the feral and untamed, wild and unpredictable “jungle” outside of it, so too, I have come to appreciate the humanity of my Catholic ancestors to a huge and fundamentally important degree. I hope you can benefit from these thoughts, and am very open to discussing these points with intellectually aware and honest interlocutors. So, feel free to let me know your views, while keeping in mind the rules.
Tags: catholicism, the kurgan, zeitgeist
As a Brit coming from a long line of Brits, you certainly have a point as regards the way we think up here north of the Hajnal line (eg more mechanistically), but I’m not sure that you’ve proved that it has a Protestant vs Catholic cause, as opposed to eg a genetic one. If genetic, then that raises an interesting point regarding the original Protestant schism: a RCC dominated by southern Europeans who tend to think differently to those in the north, trying to fit the square northern peg in a southern round hole*. As an aside, I’m reminded of that line from LotR when (I think) Treebeard says that Saruman’s mind has turned from appreciating nature to being a mind of machines and mechanisms.
Of course, untangling nature and nurture – particularly *after* Protestantism is founded – is probably impossible, and it would not surprise me if it resulted in enhancing certain traits amongst the population. But even supposing all of Europe returned to the (real) RCC tomorrow, I suspect that you would still find such psychological differences amongst the different nations 500 or 1,000 years hence.
I am also not so sure that one is better or worse than the other on the whole. We just have different strengths & weaknessess, and that will show up in everything from work ethic to form of government to family ties.
*Of course the northern peg is square. It’s been very precisely machined to the most exacting specifications by top German engineers. The hole meanwhile is the most beautifully decorated one you’re ever likely to see, thanks to the Italian craftsman that worked on it.
It’s not genetic. All you need to do is research your own history prior to 1500 or so. Even the language of middle English is far richer than present day English. See for example, The Cloud of Unknowing in its original.
Current actual (British) Catholics retain their cultural (which can be ascribed at least in part to 500 years of Protestantism (but only in part)) and ethnic traits, but every other aspect of their mentality is far more flexible and textured. In particular their sense of humour is elevated considerably, which is a sure sign of a better appreciation of reality and a more human approach to life.
And no, I do not agree. The Catholic way has disadvantages sure, but overall it is ultimately better. As for the vaunted “precison” of the Northern tribes, it is pretty much fake news. A talented Latino invariably outperforms the “superior” precision of the anglos in pretty much almost all endeavours.
American law is now Talmudic regarding case law. It was an error when we cave the judges veto power over what the legislature legislated.
Now the (traditions) of case law supercede the written law.
The legislature has to pass closer defined laws to keep the courts from completely inverting the written law.
My Kurgan friend, I do have to agree with much of what you said, having lived in a (admittedly 3rd-world) Catholic country in my childhood, as well as of course spending much time in the USA and Canada.
I will color my opinion of this in two additional ways:
1. In the American continent, the mechanistic inhumanity of work relations goes upward as you head northward… which explains Canada.
2. I think we can both agree that the French have the worst attributes of both sides while missing the better of either.
I am not sufficiently familiar with the entirety of the USA/Canada to properly comment, however, in my brief visits to Canada, (admittedly some 15 years or so ago) it seemed fairly “free” to me, but then I was on a kind of martial arts “holiday” and did not really interact with work-related things, so you may be right. But in any case, I miss the point, are you suggesting Norther Latitudes produce mechanising Systems?
I am somewhat joking, but only somewhat. There’s definitely a lot more attention to the impersonal rule-following aspects of work as you go north, although also it tends to concentrate in the big cities, so there’s another vector to consider.
But yes, it makes some sense as Teleros suggests above. The more you had to prepare for severe winter, the more you had to really concentrate on planning and systematizing things, and leaving nothing to chance.
And as others have explained, Catholicism was alive and well in ALL those Nordic countries up to 1500. And they all functioned perfectly well without mechanisation.
As I said to someone else, read stuff from England written in the 13th, 14th, 15th and early 16th Century. Even the language is richer and more human-centric and textured.
Protestantism is the only common factor that secularises Christianity, destroys the sacraments, mechanises human beings, and constantly schisms.