The tree of woe has one of the most interesting articles or blogs I have read in probably a decade. It is really good, and although a little long, and using a few technical terms I had not come across before, and while also a little bit theoretical, it is nevertheless one of the best pieces I have read in a long time, simply because he explains things so clearly that I would have struggled to explain in such an easily digestible fashion.
In essence he explains the various dynamics of how a successful rebellion to any tyrannical system, or really any system, is constructed. It is interesting because he provides concrete examples and some historical context too. But what I found quite fascinating is that I came to the same generic conclusions long ago, although my own explanation is a lot cruder (lower resolution if you like) but also a lot simpler to grasp at a baseline level, and it is this:
A group that removes infiltrators with absolute rigour and has a pretty difficult threshold to entry in terms of infiltration, and that has the ability and capacity to go and “convert” strangers to its group rules, all other things being equal, in due course will either be completely destroyed due to no one joining it, or grow to its maximum potential and remain stable once a large enough population to make itself-sustaining is reached.
If the group is also non aggressive as its default setting, it will tend to not attract too many attacks by similarly peaceful groups, and if the response to attacks is a ferocious, instant, counter that is also quite lasting in time, any group that is not overwhelmingly larger will tend to leave such a group alone.
Well. Guess what.
Sedevacantist Catholic communities are all of these things naturally. And they happen to be growing fast too.
I had not considered things in the way that the Tree of Woe guy* did, but given that his presentation makes sense, as does mine, it is always pleasant when a completely different baseline approach to a problem comes to the same conclusion. It is generally an indication you are on the right track and modelling reality relatively accurately.
So… in short, if you want to be part of the Resistance, you really need to become a proper Catholic and join a community of people that are too. Which is why I have started the process here three years ago.
Think about it:
- It’s going to be pretty hard if not almost impossible to keep up the pretence of Sedevacantist Catholicism if you actually not one, in a community of people who are.
- As a rule, Sedes will not start an argument or fight, and are essentially peaceful by nature. IF however, they are wronged, the tendency leans towards Just War, Crusades and Inquisitions. In the modern day this generally does not devolve to massive war parties going out to fight, it tends to lean towards ostracism of infiltrators or bad actors, relentless countering to any enemy attacks (which being as they are generally not physically violent in nature, are responded to proportionally) and if it does get to extremes, Catholic fighters/soldiers/warriors have absolutely no problem with doing what is necessary without hesitation. In fact, protecting oneself and innocents is a duty for a Catholic man, dogmatically.
- The number of people it takes to make a stable community is really quite low. At a gathering not too long ago, three Sede women (among which my wife) lined up for a group photo and there were 15 children there. Another group in another continent has 19 children from 4 women. Get ten such women in a community and you are going to have around 50 other humans being born to them. At least, because none of the 3 women I know have yet reached menopause. Imagine a village or area that has 100 such women and think about the numbers of hardcore Catholics you will produce in a few generations.
Catholics (real ones, i.e. Sedevacantists) are the only ones reproducing at well over replacement numbers (see my previous post on this topic.)
And for all the reasons mentioned in that previous post, no, Protestant “communities” will not be able to muster the same kind of cohesion or numbers. So… if you really mean to make a difference, you may want to start working on why Catholicism is actually the only Christianity that ever did exist, and is the only one that is in fact the Church Jesus wanted to exist on Earth.
*Which, if I read that post right, might be Alexander Macris, since he is supposedly some scary Alt-Right guy. Or whatever. The term Alt-Right was invented by foppish glowie Dick Dispenser as I call him (Richard Spencer) and was retarded from the start, given its origins. But since nowadays stating simple facts like that men cannot ever be pregnant, is apparently equivalent to being Hitler (except you know, the Nazis were National SOCIALISTS, so it’s a bit of a stretch, since, if they even had gas chambers for such things, the Nazis would probably have gassed you if you said men could get pregnant back then, I mean, they certainly burnt the books about trannification and so on, but I digress).
** Oh and Cold Fury and Western Rifle Shooters Association have both been picking up some of my posts, so thanks for that, since I am dismally bad at promoting myself even when it’s a skill I should try and learn one day.
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While I agree that currently, Most Protestant faiths are not “going forth and multiplying” the Anabaptist, better know as the Amish do. If they do not then there are not enough hands to continue the farm as they are mostly still in the 19th Century and eschue most modern ways, though they are not above using them for non farm businesses.
Unfortunately they are also on the extreme end of the pacifist end of the bell-curve, so they are not exactly going to thrive when things decent to anarchy levels.
reposting from ToW:
“The various Communist Party Cadres that operated in the 20th century are the exemplars of such coalitions.”
I have to point out that of the many such cadres, only one was successful. Lenin differed in 2 major ways from marxist ideology: he was in a rural-feudal state rather than an urban-capitalist state, and he didn’t bother trying to indoctrinate the masses with ideology. He mostly just promised them earthly rewards and a chance to get payback on the elites that had pissed on them their whole lives. Russian peasants weren’t exactly famous for their love of 100 page political tracts.
The lessons to be learned from this:
1. Ideology is less important than getting regular people on board by promising them what they want in order to put you in power. After you win, you can implement whatever ideology you want as long as you keep your powerbase happy.
2. Theory often doesn’t survive first contact with the enemy, and so we must be ready to switch it up to what works in the moment.
3. Timing is important; don’t blow your load early, be on the lookout for opportunities.
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Of course, this isn’t to say that ideology isn’t important for the various heads of splinter cells, but we shouldn’t think it’s necessary to beat every 90 IQ recruit over the head with the collected works of the Mises Institute.
Speaking of which, we may need a very broad umbrella, as the DR is very split in its goals, with many holding absolutist beliefs in many different things. We might even need a mostly negative identity: “we are not X, Y, Z!” Add in the understanding that no matter what is done, most likely there will be a lot more than 3 nations in North America in 50 years, so it’s not a winner-take-all kind of movement.
People can have their anarcho-syndicalist commune in CA, and there can be a techno-futurist monarchy in New England. Whatever. The more someone cares about their bespoke vision of the future, the harder they should work to create it IRL, rather than working harder to start drama on the internet over it.
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The takeaway for your goals would be that you don’t have to try to indoctrinate everyone with Catholic scripture/ ideology. Instead offer them what they want, and let the indoctrination/ education happen over time, at the pace and to the degree that people can handle.
example:
Tell men that if they join, there are lots of good women looking to marry good men and have lots of kids. That there are job opportunities w/i the community to support a wife and kids. That this community will oppose degeneracy especially that directed at children, violently if necessary.
Tell women that if they join, there are lots of good men with good jobs looking to marry good women and have lots of kids. That this community will oppose degeneracy especially that directed at children, violently if necessary.
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Most people don’t care about ideology or theology. They just want to be good people within a good community.
I was with you until “The Takeaway…” You are simply flat out wrong, and it’s probably due to the Anglo zeitgeist, which has marinaded in Protestantism for 5 centuries. It’s a hard no to “this is a basically a social club with the sedevacantist name appended to it” which is precisely what EVERY. SINGLE. PROTTIE. “DENOMINATION” is. No. Anyone that wants to be a part of what I am building has to be Catholic first. We’re happy to be cordial to non-Catholics as long as they are cordial to us. They can be allies, fair-weather-friends, whatever, but you honestly have absolutely no idea what you think “community” is until you have experienced the actual Catholic mindset. Perhaps the Amish may come “close” but they are absolutist pacifists and living in a technological dead end. We are neither. And yes, we have plenty of good CATHOLIC women… for good CATHOLIC men. And vice-versa. And that will absolutely not change. The last 500 years have clearly demonstrated that the minute you permit some watering down of the truth, you end up with tranny bishops eventually. And we have 2000 years of proof that no matter what attacks befall us, the Church will not perish until the return of Christ, and that promise has been kept through absolutely all sorts of statistical improbabilities, like the very start when at least 10 of the 11 apostles were martyred, and Christians were used as human torches to light the streets of Rome. Through the Arian heresy that converted at least 97% of the bishops, if not 99% to it, before the True Church doctrine triumphed. Through the schism of the East, the attacks of the Muslims, the betrayal of the East, the siege of Malta, and on, and on, and on, right up to the present 66 years of fake Popes. So, no. The Kurganate will neither be a democracy nor a melange of fake Christianity. It will be properly Catholic. As for your last sentence, regardless of it is true or not, we have seen that it is irrelevant, because all it takes for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing. Those that matter DO care about ideology AND theology. Those who do not simply don’t matter as far as creating history. They are essentially NPCs and will go in whatever direction those who DO matter point them.
You forgot the Mormons, or LDS I was born and raised around them and have their habits even if I don’t belong to their Church. IE being prepared and you and your family being thought of as a valuable member of the community. I know the LDS and Catholics have differences, but it’s mostly a thin veneer. I was raised baptist, but lean between Catholicism and Mormonism. I have yet to find a Church that hasn’t abandoned it’s values over time, but I know plenty of good Christians that haven’t.
Sorry Jim, but you’re absolutely in the “what cool club can I belong to” camp. Momonism is absolutely retarded, and was invented by a scammer who wanted to fuck people’s wives. Unless you tell me you REALLY believe Joseph Smith found angel-language gold scrolls only he could read with a prism in a tuba hat. I’m not joking. Look it up. Oh and the Angel was called MORONI. Again, not making it up. If you would be willing to die rather than denounce Joseph Smith, well… this might not be the blog for you.
I didn’t forget them. They are so ridiculous I didn’t think it worth even mentioning them.
If you want to tell me that Mormons might be decent people, yeah, so what? This is about absolute truth and who is closest to it. And what is REAL. Not what is comfortable.
[…] whatsoever that they are anything other than mostly benign NPCs. I reserve judgement on the Tree of Woe guy on that count because he made a very significant post which I commented on too, which has the potential to really make a small but absolutely fundamental […]